An opinion

[evildrem]

First of all GIP with thanks to the tantalizing telesilla for an icon that says it all..

fanfic_hate is akin to having a nasty rash. The more you scratch the worse it gets.

It was obvious that such a community was going to attract the absolute bottom feeders of the fandom community. Never before in the history of fandom have I seen such a group of people gathered together in one place who are all so desperately in need of a damn good shag! Maybe we could start up a dating service for them or something?

Oh and it's my great pleasure to welcome ptalleyrn to the swelling ranks of those who have whipped the We-hate-Tritorella brigade into foaming apoplexy. Someone make the girl a 'I'm a Nazi Enabler' icon!

As far as the anonymous commenting issue goes, I know that the so-called reasoning behind this is that it protects people from being attacked by ravening hordes of BNF minions if they express a dislike for a popular fic.

Can I just say what a load of cunting bollocks this is! If your going to dish out criticism to people then at least have the backbone to accept that this means you may be criticised back. The sooner some of these people get to grips with the idea of action = consequences the better.

Personally, I think all the authors who have had their work attacked in fanfic_hate should regard it as a back handed compliment. I think I'd be proud to know that the type of people who participate in something like fanfic_hate didn't like my writing.

For the Fact Fans out there, I would add that there is also a connection between the majority of the authors who are getting attacked in the Highlander thread. I'm sure the more intelligent among you can work out what it is.

*grins*

And that's my last word on the subject. Now I'm off to put together some Highlander recs as an antidote to all the poisionous negativity.

Toodles!

Comments

[jacquez.livejournal.com]

What I don't get is why anyone is paying any attention.

Me? The only time I hear anything about fanfic_hate is when some otherwise sensible person on my flist posts about it. Seriously. Why does anyone even bother to look?

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Because it's the classic trainwreck, and I can't not look. But I do draw the line at telling other people that they're there.

But it is truly, awe-inspiringly -- yet horribly predictably -- tacky.

Yes, I do have adverbitis. Why do you ask?

[jacquez.livejournal.com]

See - I kind of feel like if you're going to look, then you have to admit your own culpability and participation and even that you're giving those people what they want (that is, attention). And so I don't get people complaining - yeah, sure, you might hate it, but, you know...you CHOSE to park on that there railroad crossing. Why is it worth even mentioning that a train came by?

I dunno. I think it's just that my tolerance for drama is so low that I can not-look with ease and pleasure. :)

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Well, if I'm only looking and not actually participating (despite my name coming up!*g*) I figure I can sort of justify it to myself. And it wasn't like I was upset at all about the comments.

Believe me, it is not exactly a secret to me that not everyone likes my writing *g*. If they did I would have a mansion, and ponies, and Em could visit me every weekend on the Concorde.

One day..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

we will have our island and I shall people it with nubile beauties to serve you while you write darling :)

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Oh darling, you always know what to give me!

*mwah*

Your right of course..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..except that when stuff starts getting really malicious I have to do a bit more then ignore.

Re: Your right of course..

[jacquez.livejournal.com]

I understand the impulse to defend friends. :)

Well yes and no..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..in this case it matters little if its someone I know or not. We are back to that situation where someone is being hounded and attacked and accused of doing things none of which have been substantiated and none of which can be proven.

That's not right and it's also got fuck all to do their writing.

*blows raspberry*

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

It's kind of the Jerry Springer of the LJ community isn't it..

No one really wants to admit they read it, nor do they want to get involved.

You could lay money on the fact that certain people were going to get slammed though. Sometimes fandom is wonderfully predictable :)

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Very Jerry Springer. Hehehe... you almost expect someone to pipe up, 'You don't know me!'

Which I'm sure eventually someone will.

[pat-t.livejournal.com]

I know, I know. I was so guilty. Not only did I look, I admitted that I looked. As if that weren't enough, I actually conversed with one of them shudders.

I was a very bad girl!

signed
Nazi Enabler

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

And you got an up-close-and-personal look at teh crazy. Their logic is not like our Earth logic is it?

[pat-t.livejournal.com]

They used logic?! Honestly, I didn't know what hit me. Yeah, I knew I was looking at a train wreck. I even knew I was risking being hit by the train when I skirted close to the track.

But I thought I was reasonably safe. I didn't attack anyone's criticism or their right to speak their mind.

All I did was say that I love some of Tritorella's stories. This is not news. I have stated as much on the lists before. I love the Eric stories. I love some others. I think she's one hell of a writer.

yes, I know. Don't repeat it. I should have known better!

[beeej.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry, darling, I feel a bit responsible. All you were doing was agreeing with me that I liked Trit's fic. You just stepped in front of the onslaught of tomato throwing. I owe ya one. *g*

[pat-t.livejournal.com]

Not at all. I jumped in all by myself. As a matter of fact, the story you were rec'd was "From us Love Fled". I couldn't remember which one that was off the top of my head. Now, I know the names of the Eric stories cos they are my favorites, plus Cunning vixen cos it is hot and sexy and has an ailing Methos, lol.

And I was just thinking about which HL story I would pull out to reread next since I just finished "Misconceptions" again.

So, went to my CDs where I have all my favorite stories stored and found "From Us Love Fled." Oh, it's *that* story. I love it too. So why did I go brain dead on the title?

So, off to read.

And I will *not* respond ( not even anonymously) to the mentally disturbed person on the fanfic hate list who stated that Methos did not make her hot and she didn't give a crap about him.

You know, if she came into my ED, I'd call the mental hospital to come and do an evaluation on her.

[beeej.livejournal.com]

And I will *not* respond ( not even anonymously) to the mentally disturbed person on the fanfic hate list who stated that Methos did not make her hot and she didn't give a crap about him.


I just tell myself that those who post such things are just setting out bait. I prefer to swim away and live to play another day. :)

[pat-t.livejournal.com]

thank you gorgeous. You pulled me back just in the nick of time.

[kiriko-moth.livejournal.com]

And I see that they gave you a right good drubbing for having the audacity to think for yourself.

*grinning*

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

I suppose it's kind of like a car crash. You want to ignore it but you just have to have a quick peek.

I've fairly successfully ignored the whole mess up until now but there are some things which needed to be said. Plus the whole Nazi Enabler thing was just too amusing to ignore.

Am off to frolic in the smut shallows where I rightly belong again now...

[bethcarielle.livejournal.com]

I had to look because it was so unbelievable. And then I had to say something when I saw my name mentioned, especially when Oblitus Esse was mentioned...I hate that one too. Knee-jerk reaction.

Has left me with the urge to write though.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Now I'm off to put together some Highlander recs as an antidote to all the poisionous negativity.

Ooh goody! Did you read Killa's new Matthew/Connor fic? Really lovely story, I liked it a lot.

Yeah was very good..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..as usual :) Killa *rocks*, she's another one of those authors who makes me want to give up writing altogether!

I 've been doing a lot of reading actually. Lots of good stuff about. You read Fools Gold yet?

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Yep:) Read and enjoyed Fools Gold. Still haven't sent feeback of course, because I am a lazy lazy girl.

But slutty!Max and vampire!Aaron...mmm...yum.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

or indeed feedback, because I also cannot type ;)

[unovis-lj.livejournal.com]

Me myself and I, I agree about avoiding anonymous criticism. I want my name on what I say.

But I don't think all the criticism on that site is linked or coming from the same vipers rehashing old feuds. I don't think they all arise from envy or ill-will toward the authors. I think taking the complaints about, say, Rory's ape-rape story as backhanded compliments would be delusional.

I have very similar views to those expressed on Rory, The Chaos Chronicles, Specter, and Kijikun-Ryenna. There are other authors' stories mentioned there that could, indeed, have been more tightly wrapped, though I don't think the writers should be ridden anywhere on a rail.

The site's a piss-pit. But not all the complaints about stories there are invalid.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

No, you're absolutely right. The eye-watering badness of Rory or Mary Ewing cannot be denied, nor can the egregious meandering of my little epic. But the personal stuff was a whole other ball game. Particularly the surreal exchange where some brain-donor asserted that enjoying an author's stories means that you approve and support everything that author has ever done, or has been accused of doing since Mum met Dad.

Which means all Alice in Wonderland fans aupport paedophilia.

Ack!

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

Does that because I like your stories I support your habit of keeping nubile young girls locked in your basement as playthings?

Cos I don't you know..

I think your mean and should share your toys!

*smooch*

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Damn, my secret's out. I mean...darling, I'd always share with you, you know that.

I think...

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

Your perhaps reading more into my post then you should. As for criticism of this kind. I don't go a bundle on people bashing other people's stories and writing in this fashion. It's not constructive and it helps no one.

If you don't like someone's story or style of writing don't read anymore of their stuff. If you feel that strongly about it then write to the author and explain what you think, preferably without being rude.

There are many, many fics out there that I really don't like for a whole host of reasons. As yet I have not found the need or the urge to shout about how much I hate them in a public forum.

It's a sad fact however that the majority of this type of so called 'criticism' of people's stories is actually motivated more by people wanting to hurt and upset the authors then by any desire to be constructive about their writing.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

t's a sad fact however that the majority of this type of so called 'criticism' of people's stories is actually motivated more by people wanting to hurt and upset the authors then by any desire to be constructive about their writing.

Well, if that was the intent when they mentioned mine, they failed miserably, cos like I said earlier...the fact that my writing is not universally beloved is not exactly a secret to me. So I found it amusing more than anything.

Probably other writers' mileages may vary though.

Well let's face it..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..the crit of your stories was so lame it was nearly dead. Methinks there were other reasons for that as well *winks*

Anyway we all know your a tough old boot with hide like a rhino! You kinda enjoy it! :)

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Anyway we all know your a tough old boot with hide like a rhino! You kinda enjoy it! :)

It truly doesn't bother me. But of course that doesn't negate the fact that everytime I post a story I still expect someone to write back and tell me it was the worst thing they ever read.

One day someone will *g*.

Well if they do..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..laugh heartily at them. You write exceedingly well and none of the criticism leveled at Kiss of Shadows was particularly fair, nor inded accurate.

I think the extra detail you gave to the location of your story added to the flavour, I thought your OC's were interesting and not intrusive and I am just baffled by the criticism that having D and M apart for most of the story was a problem..

Inevitably there will always be people who do not like your work because it is not to their taste or because they do not see the characters as you do. This does not mean you writing is bad or that your story is not woirth reading. To be honest I wish more people in fandom spent as much time researching what they write like you do!

Example. I really dislike Loch Ness' story. The characterisation of Duncan is not bad but her Methos is not one I recognise. Yet, she is obviously a very competent writer, the story flows well and I can understand why a lot of people like it very much.

I would not rec it myself as I did not enjoy it. That does not make me think it is over rated however or motivate me to condemn it in public.

I think a lot of the fandom community need to mature a bit intellectually and realise that just because someone does not see a character the way they do does not mean they are 'teh EVIL' *grins*

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

Inevitably there will always be people who do not like your work because it is not to their taste or because they do not see the characters as you do. This does not mean you writing is bad or that your story is not worth reading.

Which is why this sort of thing doesn't upset me at all. It's just people's opinions. I can't change them and I don't expect that everyone will have the same one, so there's no point in getting upset about it.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

If you don't like someone's story or style of writing don't read anymore of their stuff. If you feel that strongly about it then write to the author and explain what you think, preferably without being rude.

I dunno, hon. Have you ever tried actually doing this? Nine times out of ten you get a very defensive reply accusing you of flaming them, when all you've done was very gently explain what you didn't like about the fic. After a while you just stop bothering about it. Which is not to say I support the anonymous bitchfest idea. I prefer to bitch to my friends instead *g*.

And I kind of get the urge to WTF? about over-rated stuff. I know heaps of times when we Bris-fen are talking about fic, someone will mention some story that got a shitload of feedback and yet is marginally literate or unrecognisably characterised. Part of our ongoing whine about the unfairness of life *g*.

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

I dunno, hon. Have you ever tried actually doing this? Nine times out of ten you get a very defensive reply accusing you of flaming them, when all you've done was very gently explain what you didn't like about the fic. After a while you just stop bothering about it. Which is not to say I support the anonymous bitchfest idea. I prefer to bitch to my friends instead *g

To be honest darling if I really don't like someone's writing I just don't read anymore of them. I rarely if ever feel the need to rip a story I don't like apart because I'm too bloody lazy! :)

I agree that at times I go WTF at popular stories which I heartily dislike but then I put that down to personal taste.

On the whole I can differentiate between a badly written story and one that is not my personal cup of tea. I think a lot of the time people fail to make that distinction.

But yeah, occasionally you need to bitch about things to people. I accept that but doing it anonymously in public is just pointless and most of the time needlessly vicious.

[lastrega.livejournal.com]

But yeah, occasionally you need to bitch about things to people. I accept that but doing it anonymously in public is just pointless and most of the time needlessly vicious.

Yeah, completely agree. I see these things and think, 'don't these people have friends they can whine to?' It's much more satisfying and less damaging to all concerned.

Re: I think...

[unovis-lj.livejournal.com]

mmmmm -- I'm sorry, I'm not superhuman. There's some almighty crap out there that very occasionally will inspire me to stand on my own dunghill to bitch against.

I firmly do not believe that I should have to address all complaints directly to the author in kind, patient syllables. Not all criticism is for the author's benefit. Discussing how a story doesn't work or is flat-out bad is an exercise in itself.

I know there's a difference between substantial crit and screaming This was shit! and I know f-hate is mostly garbage. I still have a certain sympathy for primal screams about overrated bad writing. And I'm not dictating behavior to anyone else.

Primal scream badfic therapy..

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

..wow, now that's an idea! *grins*

No I understand and as I said I'm not saying that no one should ever complain about someone's writing ever, ever, ever.

I just find the whole concept of places like fanfic_hate bizarre (for lack of a better word) and I can't see how they benefit anyone, in anyway.

But you know, that's me. It's not like I can stop anyone :)

[nmg.livejournal.com]

Wow. I read ajhalluk's post (http://www.livejournal.com/users/ajhalluk/105216.html) on the fanfic_hate fooforall earlier this morning, but didn't go and look at it until now. Has no-one ever told these people about Godwin's Law (http://info.astrian.net/jargon/terms/g/Godwin_s_Law.html)?

Ah, this reminds me of the good old days on Usenet before the Eternal September...

[tritorella.livejournal.com]

Oh and it's my great pleasure to welcome [info]ptalleyrn to the swelling ranks of those who have whipped the We-hate-Tritorella brigade into foaming apoplexy. Someone make the girl a 'I'm a Nazi Enabler' icon!

in the hope of making at least four separate heads explode, I'm reinstating my journal and my fiction. (http://freedom.aeglos.org/ziparchives/index.html) After all, it would just be rude to deny people their pointlessly cruel whining harmless fun.

Not to mention what I think (http://www.livejournal.com/users/tritorella/) of people trying to censor other people's thoughts, never mind stop them reading what they want.

Now sit back and wait for the pea soup to start flying and the heads to spin!

[kijikun.livejournal.com]

What we all have in common...bad spelling?

No wait that's just me. *G*

But seriously a lot of the hate in there seems to really have nothing to do with the authors works and more with who wrote it.

[darthhellokitty.livejournal.com]

Hey, you know telesilla?!! Woo hoo! :-)

*grins*

[evildrem.livejournal.com]

Yeah from the same place you do I suspect. On the MA list. I've been following her stuff in the Establishment for a while, I think she and I have very similar tastes in people ;)

I just wish she wasn't mainly over in the place-of-which-do-not-speak!

Re: *grins*

[darthhellokitty.livejournal.com]

Oh, I know her rather more than that. Ask her about her toaster oven! :-)

Yeah, shame about the [bad place]; she's sort of fallen in with a bad crowd over there. Her RPG stuff is a serious hoot.